| BARRIOZONA |
| Bilingual Community Expression Published by the Hispanic Institute of Social Issues |
| The four-time elected Maricopa County Sheriff talks about his life, his work, Arizona hot issues, and his unfinished quest to continue being the toughest -yet compassionate- Sheriff. |
| Toughness with Compassion |
Joe Arpaio's Formula
| Interview by Yolie Hernandez Photographs by Eduardo Barraza |
| Photograph and Photoshop effect by Eduardo Barraza / BARRIOZONA |
BARRIOZONA: You are without a doubt a controversial
public servant, who receives both praise and criticism. Who is
Joe Arpaio?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: There’s only one like me, although
some people say: “We should clone you.” But there can only
be one Joe Arpaio. I was born and raised June 14—Flag Day—
1932, in Springfield, Massachusetts. Worked hard for my
father that came from Italy and mother; my mother died
when I was born, so I went from family to family, but I
worked hard. In high school I played all the sports; worked
in my father’s grocery store; joined the Army in 1950, when I
turned 18; went on to a police department in Washington
D.C., then Las Vegas; joined the Bureau of Narcotics, which
is now known as the Drug Enforcement Administration; and I
worked almost 30 years with the Federal Government
fighting the international drug traffic. I was the Regional
public servant, who receives both praise and criticism. Who is
Joe Arpaio?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: There’s only one like me, although
some people say: “We should clone you.” But there can only
be one Joe Arpaio. I was born and raised June 14—Flag Day—
1932, in Springfield, Massachusetts. Worked hard for my
father that came from Italy and mother; my mother died
when I was born, so I went from family to family, but I
worked hard. In high school I played all the sports; worked
in my father’s grocery store; joined the Army in 1950, when I
turned 18; went on to a police department in Washington
D.C., then Las Vegas; joined the Bureau of Narcotics, which
is now known as the Drug Enforcement Administration; and I
worked almost 30 years with the Federal Government
fighting the international drug traffic. I was the Regional
Director in Mexico; lived in Mexico City, I had offices in Bogota [Colombia], and Argentina, so I covered Latin
America; and I was the only Federal Agent in Turkey, in the Middle East, fighting the drug traffic. I was in charge of
the DEA—Drug Enforcement Administration—in Texas, so I know about that border—frontera. I was the Head of
the Federal Drug Enforcement in Arizona; I know about the Arizona border. So I have 14 years experience working
on a Mexican-U.S. border. I ran for Sheriff in 1992. I beat the Sheriff that was in office and I have been reelected
ever since. And, I’m going to run for the fifth time next year and I expect to be reelected again—for all those critics
out there and opponents that are always trying to take this Sheriff down. Ain’t gonna happen!
BARRIOZONA: Many accuse you of deliberately seeking media attention and publicity: What are your thoughts on
this?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: I report to the people. Four million people, I report to—that we know of. So, since I’m
elected, the people are my bosses. I don’t report to any governor, any bureaucrat, or politician. I think the people
should know what this Sheriff is doing. I don’t run a CIA secret organization, so if you say I’m a publicity hound or
whatever, you came to me, I didn’t go to you. They all come to me; am I suppose to say, “Go talk to a Sergeant”,
like everybody else says—especially (about) controversy? There’s only one Sheriff in town, and that’s me, and I
talk to the people! So if they want to call me a publicity hound, that’s okay with me.
America; and I was the only Federal Agent in Turkey, in the Middle East, fighting the drug traffic. I was in charge of
the DEA—Drug Enforcement Administration—in Texas, so I know about that border—frontera. I was the Head of
the Federal Drug Enforcement in Arizona; I know about the Arizona border. So I have 14 years experience working
on a Mexican-U.S. border. I ran for Sheriff in 1992. I beat the Sheriff that was in office and I have been reelected
ever since. And, I’m going to run for the fifth time next year and I expect to be reelected again—for all those critics
out there and opponents that are always trying to take this Sheriff down. Ain’t gonna happen!
BARRIOZONA: Many accuse you of deliberately seeking media attention and publicity: What are your thoughts on
this?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: I report to the people. Four million people, I report to—that we know of. So, since I’m
elected, the people are my bosses. I don’t report to any governor, any bureaucrat, or politician. I think the people
should know what this Sheriff is doing. I don’t run a CIA secret organization, so if you say I’m a publicity hound or
whatever, you came to me, I didn’t go to you. They all come to me; am I suppose to say, “Go talk to a Sergeant”,
like everybody else says—especially (about) controversy? There’s only one Sheriff in town, and that’s me, and I
talk to the people! So if they want to call me a publicity hound, that’s okay with me.
BARRIOZONA: Do you believe media attention has contributed to
the success of your work as Sheriff?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: It’s a “love-hate” relationship—especially
with the newspapers. The newspapers here won’t print every
time we arrest illegal immigrants on a felony. These are serious
crimes—the smuggler and the controversial arresting of the
people being smuggled in. They don’t cover the story, but
national (media) does, so if they don’t want to cover it here, it
doesn’t bother me because I get plenty of coverage on national
or international (media).
BARRIOZONA: What do you consider to be the most difficult law
enforcement problems Maricopa County faces today?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: I think that one of the problems we have
to watch out for is we are increasing our population. We now
have four million; the City of Phoenix is the fifth largest in the
country. We are about the second or third largest sheriff’s office
in the United States. So we have to look at the increase of
population; we have to look at the environment; of course, my
expertise is in law enforcement—45 years. So as the Sheriff, we
have to look in to the jails overcrowding; I don’t have a defeatist
attitude. I have two thousand rooms in the tent, I’m going to
build more tents, that “VACANCY” sign will always shine. Do you
think I’m going to do like other people do and put a “NO
VACANCY” sign up? Or don’t let them be booked like in California,
if you’re normally arrested on a misdemeanor, they don’t even
the success of your work as Sheriff?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: It’s a “love-hate” relationship—especially
with the newspapers. The newspapers here won’t print every
time we arrest illegal immigrants on a felony. These are serious
crimes—the smuggler and the controversial arresting of the
people being smuggled in. They don’t cover the story, but
national (media) does, so if they don’t want to cover it here, it
doesn’t bother me because I get plenty of coverage on national
or international (media).
BARRIOZONA: What do you consider to be the most difficult law
enforcement problems Maricopa County faces today?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: I think that one of the problems we have
to watch out for is we are increasing our population. We now
have four million; the City of Phoenix is the fifth largest in the
country. We are about the second or third largest sheriff’s office
in the United States. So we have to look at the increase of
population; we have to look at the environment; of course, my
expertise is in law enforcement—45 years. So as the Sheriff, we
have to look in to the jails overcrowding; I don’t have a defeatist
attitude. I have two thousand rooms in the tent, I’m going to
build more tents, that “VACANCY” sign will always shine. Do you
think I’m going to do like other people do and put a “NO
VACANCY” sign up? Or don’t let them be booked like in California,
if you’re normally arrested on a misdemeanor, they don’t even
take you to jail? Never gonna happen here. I run the jails, any law enforcement officer that wants to arrest
anybody, I will take. I will never give an excuse: “Don’t bring them here I have no room.”
BARRIOZONA: How is the drug smuggling in the U.S.-Mexico border different today than when you worked for the
DEA?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: The smuggling of drugs coming into the United States from Mexico really hasn’t changed
that much (from) when I was the Director there. South America, use to come through Central America and Mexico
across the border easier than going directly into Florida, what they used to do then was called the “French
Connection,” the heroin from France; there was just too much heat, so they switched. Right now the drugs are still
coming from South America, instead of going directly to Miami, they’re coming in through the U.S.-Mexican border,
more under control from the Mexico traffickers. However, there is a lot of violence; a lot of wars going on at the
border; they’re killing police officers, a lot of threats out there. So there seems to be more of a war going on today
then when I was over there.
BARRIOZONA: You spent some time in Mexico: How did you feel about the people there—the Mexican people?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: I spent four years in Mexico. I used to meet with Presidente (Luis) Echeveria, [Pedro] Ojeda
Paullada, de Procuraduría (from the Attorney General’s Office). I had a great relationship with the Mexicans and the
Mexican people. The Attorney General would come to my house—and my wife liked to cook a blueberry pie—and the
Attorney General loved blueberry pie. So I got more work done—cooperation—with the Mexican Government over
blueberry pie than the “big stick”—the big stick. So I have compassion for the Mexican people, for all people around
this world. The Italians, my mother and father were Italian, I’m proud to say. I have an Italian background; on the
other hand I’m still an American first, a U.S. citizen. So I got a lot done; in Argentina, all over, I have a mutual
respect type of philosophy and that’s how you get things done.
anybody, I will take. I will never give an excuse: “Don’t bring them here I have no room.”
BARRIOZONA: How is the drug smuggling in the U.S.-Mexico border different today than when you worked for the
DEA?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: The smuggling of drugs coming into the United States from Mexico really hasn’t changed
that much (from) when I was the Director there. South America, use to come through Central America and Mexico
across the border easier than going directly into Florida, what they used to do then was called the “French
Connection,” the heroin from France; there was just too much heat, so they switched. Right now the drugs are still
coming from South America, instead of going directly to Miami, they’re coming in through the U.S.-Mexican border,
more under control from the Mexico traffickers. However, there is a lot of violence; a lot of wars going on at the
border; they’re killing police officers, a lot of threats out there. So there seems to be more of a war going on today
then when I was over there.
BARRIOZONA: You spent some time in Mexico: How did you feel about the people there—the Mexican people?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: I spent four years in Mexico. I used to meet with Presidente (Luis) Echeveria, [Pedro] Ojeda
Paullada, de Procuraduría (from the Attorney General’s Office). I had a great relationship with the Mexicans and the
Mexican people. The Attorney General would come to my house—and my wife liked to cook a blueberry pie—and the
Attorney General loved blueberry pie. So I got more work done—cooperation—with the Mexican Government over
blueberry pie than the “big stick”—the big stick. So I have compassion for the Mexican people, for all people around
this world. The Italians, my mother and father were Italian, I’m proud to say. I have an Italian background; on the
other hand I’m still an American first, a U.S. citizen. So I got a lot done; in Argentina, all over, I have a mutual
respect type of philosophy and that’s how you get things done.
BARRIOZONA: Illegal immigration seems
to be out of control: What impact do you
believe your department’s enforcement is
having on this issue?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: I think we are
having an impact. Because a lot of people
don’t want to hear this, I don’t know about
building a fence, that’s just going to sell
more shovels and more ladders. I say,
when you come across the border, you
arrest them. There is a Federal law,
anybody crossing the border is here can
get six months in jail. Nobody enforces that
law. See the people we arrested under the
State law, they can’t work behind bars—
I’m mean, they can work cleaning the floor
(in the jail) —but they can’t work
(elsewhere), make money to send back to
to be out of control: What impact do you
believe your department’s enforcement is
having on this issue?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: I think we are
having an impact. Because a lot of people
don’t want to hear this, I don’t know about
building a fence, that’s just going to sell
more shovels and more ladders. I say,
when you come across the border, you
arrest them. There is a Federal law,
anybody crossing the border is here can
get six months in jail. Nobody enforces that
law. See the people we arrested under the
State law, they can’t work behind bars—
I’m mean, they can work cleaning the floor
(in the jail) —but they can’t work
(elsewhere), make money to send back to
their loved ones. So if you arrest them as they come across, there is no reason to come across if you’re going to end
up in jail or in tents down there. So that’s going to keep people from coming across. Economically: why would you
come here if you’re going to go to jail, you can’t work to send money back to your family? So why do we enforce the
law that nobody wants to enforce? They talk about security, no one has said let’s arrest them. No one has said put
them in jail; “oh, let’s enforce the border,” okay. Are they doing it now? Yeah, but what do they do, they send them
back. Back and forth, back and forth, back and forth! They don’t want to put them in jail! That’s as simple as I’m
saying. And if you say the Hispanic community, some of them are against me, I don’t think they really understand the
situation. I have been married fifty years, my wife deserves a maid. Do you think that I can’t hire a maid and pay
cash—an illegal—do you think I can’t do that? But I won’t do it. And it’s not fair for the legitimate company that I
have to pay double to that company when I could have paid half, if I hired illegals. Do you understand? Of course, if I
hired an illegal, I’d be in the front page all over the world. If anybody else hires an illegal, they pay cash, nobody
cares. I wonder how many people are hiring illegals, from all walks of life? Then they say one thing, but they are
doing another thing. But I’m not! I’m going to follow the law!
BARRIOZONA: “America’s Toughest Sheriff…”
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: …The world’s…
BARRIOZONA: …how does this title suit you, and if you could choose a title to describe yourself, what would it be?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: I’m a romantic. I’ve been married for fifty years. I’m really not a tough guy, I’m tough in my
job, but I have compassion. I mean, do you think if I’m arresting all these people I go home at night and celebrate? I
don’t celebrate. You know, I have some compassion for the criminals. I used to associate with criminals; I did a lot of
undercover work all over the world. And when you work undercover you sometimes use informants, do you think the
informants are priests? The informants are bank robbers and everything else. So I’ve associated with the criminal, it
doesn’t bother me, I understand the criminal mind. But my philosophy is: You do something wrong, you have to pay
for it. You have to pay; you play you pay. And you should be punished. We use to punish our children when we were
young; we use to take privileges away from our kids when they did something wrong. So I can never understand
why no one uses the word “punishment” in the jail or prison. It’s always “education,” “rehabilitation,” you never
want to punish anybody or take away their privileges. But we can punish and take away privileges from our
children—we use to—but we can’t do that? Why is it bad to say, “you do something wrong you have to not live in
the Hilton Hotel”? Why is it wrong? Because I took away their television, except for the weather channel and the
food channel, and the only reason I keep the TV is because a judge said 20 years ago they had to have it. I took
away all their movies; I took away their pornography; I took away their coffee; took away their salt; okay, I can go
on and on. I give them 15 cent meals instead of steak; they eat a bologna sandwich and an orange at brunch—only
two meals—then (we) give them a hot meal. Why do they have to live nice when they did something wrong? I can’t
understand that. But everybody else doesn’t want to understand, not everybody, you understand? Evidently, since I
have four million bosses—that we know of, there’s a few roaming around that we don’t know are here, okay—but if I
have four million bosses, isn’t it nice to report directly to them and not have to report to a governor or a bureaucrat?
And evidently, the people like what I’m doing. Now, I don’t do this job to build up a resume. When I leave here, I’m
going to ride off into the sunset—it won’t be on a horse, cause I haven’t been on a horse—and I know the day I
leave, you won’t be asking me to talk to me: I’m a nothing. So, I don’t understand that. Also, I don’t get a big salary;
I have fifty people who work for me who make more money than I do. So it’s not for money; it’s not to be the
Governor, which I could have been—so why do I do this? I work 14 hours a day, 7 days a week. Why do I do this?
That’s a good question isn’t it? And it’s hard for me to answer, but I will give you the answer: Whatever I do, I
always do strong. I don’t do things halfway. But the real answer is this—and all politicians will tell you the same
thing—oh, I’m here because I serve the people—they don’t even say that anymore, they should, but they do serve
the people. But I’m here with my special link connection that I have with the people of this county, if I didn’t have
the people that want me, I’d leave tomorrow, leave tomorrow; I don’t need this job.
BARRIOZONA: What training do your officers receive?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: Our people are well trained. We have a great academy. We built a brand new academy; I
worked hard to do that 5 years ago. And even other law enforcement (agencies) ask me to train their cops. On the
immigration, we’ll have the largest compliment—group—trained by the Immigration Customs Enforcement—ICE. We
already have graduated 72, we have 40 more now, and we’re going to have 160, the largest in the history of the
United States, trained where we can put our Federal hat on to enforce the immigration laws. As far as all my officers
working in the jail, they’re well trained. We have almost 4000 employees; second largest Sheriffs office in the United
States. I’m going to keep leading this office, I’m not going to give it up to any so called opponent, and I’m going to
keep going. I’m going to keep going and when I feel I can’t do the job, then I’ll leave.
BARRIOZONA: Is there anything you’d like to add?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: I want to thank you for the opportunity to speak to you. I don’t want to insult you, but I’ll
talk to anybody. I even talk to the inmates; I go in the tents, I slept in the tents twice.
BARRIOZONA: During the summer?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: No, I’m not stupid, I’m not that stupid. But I went to purposely tell the inmates: if I can
sleep here, shut your mouths and stop complaining. You understand? As far as illegal immigration, I don’t think it’s
going to stop, I think it’s going to continue; I don’t think Congress has the guts to come up with a final plan, but I’m
going to do what my job is fighting illegal immigration. We have a lot of investigations going on other matters, I
want to be here to make sure those cases are done properly. They may be controversial investigations against
certain people, but I’m going to be here to make sure we get the proper conclusion and we will continue to do what
I’ve been doing.
up in jail or in tents down there. So that’s going to keep people from coming across. Economically: why would you
come here if you’re going to go to jail, you can’t work to send money back to your family? So why do we enforce the
law that nobody wants to enforce? They talk about security, no one has said let’s arrest them. No one has said put
them in jail; “oh, let’s enforce the border,” okay. Are they doing it now? Yeah, but what do they do, they send them
back. Back and forth, back and forth, back and forth! They don’t want to put them in jail! That’s as simple as I’m
saying. And if you say the Hispanic community, some of them are against me, I don’t think they really understand the
situation. I have been married fifty years, my wife deserves a maid. Do you think that I can’t hire a maid and pay
cash—an illegal—do you think I can’t do that? But I won’t do it. And it’s not fair for the legitimate company that I
have to pay double to that company when I could have paid half, if I hired illegals. Do you understand? Of course, if I
hired an illegal, I’d be in the front page all over the world. If anybody else hires an illegal, they pay cash, nobody
cares. I wonder how many people are hiring illegals, from all walks of life? Then they say one thing, but they are
doing another thing. But I’m not! I’m going to follow the law!
BARRIOZONA: “America’s Toughest Sheriff…”
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: …The world’s…
BARRIOZONA: …how does this title suit you, and if you could choose a title to describe yourself, what would it be?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: I’m a romantic. I’ve been married for fifty years. I’m really not a tough guy, I’m tough in my
job, but I have compassion. I mean, do you think if I’m arresting all these people I go home at night and celebrate? I
don’t celebrate. You know, I have some compassion for the criminals. I used to associate with criminals; I did a lot of
undercover work all over the world. And when you work undercover you sometimes use informants, do you think the
informants are priests? The informants are bank robbers and everything else. So I’ve associated with the criminal, it
doesn’t bother me, I understand the criminal mind. But my philosophy is: You do something wrong, you have to pay
for it. You have to pay; you play you pay. And you should be punished. We use to punish our children when we were
young; we use to take privileges away from our kids when they did something wrong. So I can never understand
why no one uses the word “punishment” in the jail or prison. It’s always “education,” “rehabilitation,” you never
want to punish anybody or take away their privileges. But we can punish and take away privileges from our
children—we use to—but we can’t do that? Why is it bad to say, “you do something wrong you have to not live in
the Hilton Hotel”? Why is it wrong? Because I took away their television, except for the weather channel and the
food channel, and the only reason I keep the TV is because a judge said 20 years ago they had to have it. I took
away all their movies; I took away their pornography; I took away their coffee; took away their salt; okay, I can go
on and on. I give them 15 cent meals instead of steak; they eat a bologna sandwich and an orange at brunch—only
two meals—then (we) give them a hot meal. Why do they have to live nice when they did something wrong? I can’t
understand that. But everybody else doesn’t want to understand, not everybody, you understand? Evidently, since I
have four million bosses—that we know of, there’s a few roaming around that we don’t know are here, okay—but if I
have four million bosses, isn’t it nice to report directly to them and not have to report to a governor or a bureaucrat?
And evidently, the people like what I’m doing. Now, I don’t do this job to build up a resume. When I leave here, I’m
going to ride off into the sunset—it won’t be on a horse, cause I haven’t been on a horse—and I know the day I
leave, you won’t be asking me to talk to me: I’m a nothing. So, I don’t understand that. Also, I don’t get a big salary;
I have fifty people who work for me who make more money than I do. So it’s not for money; it’s not to be the
Governor, which I could have been—so why do I do this? I work 14 hours a day, 7 days a week. Why do I do this?
That’s a good question isn’t it? And it’s hard for me to answer, but I will give you the answer: Whatever I do, I
always do strong. I don’t do things halfway. But the real answer is this—and all politicians will tell you the same
thing—oh, I’m here because I serve the people—they don’t even say that anymore, they should, but they do serve
the people. But I’m here with my special link connection that I have with the people of this county, if I didn’t have
the people that want me, I’d leave tomorrow, leave tomorrow; I don’t need this job.
BARRIOZONA: What training do your officers receive?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: Our people are well trained. We have a great academy. We built a brand new academy; I
worked hard to do that 5 years ago. And even other law enforcement (agencies) ask me to train their cops. On the
immigration, we’ll have the largest compliment—group—trained by the Immigration Customs Enforcement—ICE. We
already have graduated 72, we have 40 more now, and we’re going to have 160, the largest in the history of the
United States, trained where we can put our Federal hat on to enforce the immigration laws. As far as all my officers
working in the jail, they’re well trained. We have almost 4000 employees; second largest Sheriffs office in the United
States. I’m going to keep leading this office, I’m not going to give it up to any so called opponent, and I’m going to
keep going. I’m going to keep going and when I feel I can’t do the job, then I’ll leave.
BARRIOZONA: Is there anything you’d like to add?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: I want to thank you for the opportunity to speak to you. I don’t want to insult you, but I’ll
talk to anybody. I even talk to the inmates; I go in the tents, I slept in the tents twice.
BARRIOZONA: During the summer?
SHERIFF JOE ARPAIO: No, I’m not stupid, I’m not that stupid. But I went to purposely tell the inmates: if I can
sleep here, shut your mouths and stop complaining. You understand? As far as illegal immigration, I don’t think it’s
going to stop, I think it’s going to continue; I don’t think Congress has the guts to come up with a final plan, but I’m
going to do what my job is fighting illegal immigration. We have a lot of investigations going on other matters, I
want to be here to make sure those cases are done properly. They may be controversial investigations against
certain people, but I’m going to be here to make sure we get the proper conclusion and we will continue to do what
I’ve been doing.
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